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Article Source: msnbc.com
Legalize it all ready! How much longer do we have to wait for our government to pull it's collective head out of its' rear end and end this insanity?! The time has long since passed.
But this article is very encouraging even though I had to do a search to find it. I also noticed there wasn't any comment section for the article. Seems MSNBC does this quite often with marijuana related articles.
Glorious will be the day when our government stops the persecution of the harmless pot smoker.
The answer to the drug problem is to end the spectacularly failed costly Drug War.
They say the Drug War is over. Don't be fooled. As long as drugs remain criminalized the Drug War will never be over.
When is the U.S. government going to finally realize that it can't legislate morality? Many people believe the answer to solving our drug problem is to simply tell people to say "no" to drugs but after being in practice for decades now the evidence shows this has failed miserably. People have been doing drugs for thousands of years and it's never going to stop. There will always be people who do drugs and those who become addicted.
Didn't we learn from the mistakes of Alcohol Prohibition in the 1920s/30s? It didn't work then, and drug prohibition certainly isn't working now. The failed Drug War has cost the U.S. taxpayers over a trillion dollars and has been in force for over seven decades. And the real tragedy here is all of the violence that has been associated with the Drug War and illegal drug trafficking. Drugs are more readily available and the Drug War has created a black market, gangs in every U.S. state, and powerful violent cartels south of the border and in other countries.
The laws have done more damage to this country than the drugs themselves. We have created more criminals out of drug users/addicts who should really be treated as medical patients. Wouldn't we be better off spending the Drug War funding on education, drug treatment and rehabilitation instead of failed law enforcement and incarceration? And not having to build more prisons?
We need to reevaluate our position on drug use in this country. I firmly believe we should decriminalize all drugs. Legalize marijuana and regulate it like alcohol in regards to the law, and create an atmosphere that doesn't stigmatize the drug user. I would never advocate anyone use dangerous hard drugs like meth, cocaine, heroin, etc. But the fact of life remains people will choose to use such drugs and become addicted. Countries in Europe have tried different strategies that have reduced the problems associated with drug use. Why can't the U.S. take these same approaches? We should adopt programs for hard drugs (meth, coke, heroin,etc.) like the Swiss heroin program (where addicts can get their drugs from medically supervised clinics) which has shown positive results in reducing violent crime and HIV infections and helps drug addicts to become stable and productive members of society.
Locking people up and throwing away the key is not the answer. When someone has a real drug problem and is addicted their main focus will always be to obtain and use drugs, regardless of any law. And putting a mark on someone's permanent record that will follow them for the rest of their lives will only hinder them to become productive members in society in getting jobs, student financial aid, etc.
There are many people against legalizing and/or decriminalizing drugs and have expressed many fears and dooms day scenarios but evidence has revealed this would simply NOT be the result. Portugal decriminalized drugs in 2001 and none of the nightmare scenarios touted by preenactment decriminalization opponents have become a reality.
And what are the ramifications of manufacturing, importing, and selling the drugs right here in the U.S? Wouldn't that create a new industry? Jobs? Tax revenue? And stop funding the violent cartels and eventually take away their power?
These are questions that I think once answered, will solve our drug problems and the days of the Drug War will be history.
"If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich" -- John F. Kennedy .
#1 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:53 PM ESTgod! could not happen soon enough for me!!!! can't wait for november...definitely voting!
I can't wait either joe! I live in Virginia so it won't be happening anytime soon here. But with that said, if it is legalized in any of the states that have it on the November ballot it will be the beginning of the wave of change that is going to sweep the country.
Then it is going to be a front and center issue that the Feds can't just sweep under the rug. I'm willing to bet even before the elections this issue is going to get more and more press. It will take this debate to a whole new level.
To say I am excited and with hope is an understatement.
Then it is going to be a front and center issue that the Feds can't just sweep under the rug.
Umm... yeah they can. In any given year, about 20 Million Americans smoke marijuana. That seems like a lot of Americans but really, looking at the numbers...
There are 310 Million Americans total. If 20 Million Americans smoke marijuana, then as a percentage that's only 7% of Americans toking up. 93% of Americans didn't want marijuana last year.
Even more damning for weedsters is the fact that the voting age is 18, and most kids don't vote. The youth vote (under 21) in 2010 was a mere 15% of eligible voters.
Realistically, weedsters can only expect, as maximum performance, a voter turnout of 4% for people who have smoked marijuana in the past year.
Tobacco smokers have 20% of the population and they can't defeat a single increase on tobacco taxes or any laws against tobacco restrictions in bars, restaurants, theaters, buses or any other law restricting their habit. Weedsters have barely a FIFTH of the voting power of the tobacco users, and not even any of the backing of big tobacco companies, and they think they're going to change the world.
Not gonna happen. Sorry, but when 96% of Americans don't join your cause then you don't have a cause. What you've got is a fringe element of activists who think they've got a cause.
kinda...except for the fact that we have the AMA behind us and numerous medical associations recommending a change...these are scientists that know better than you. people with ph.d's. even our government holds a patent on medical marijuana even as they deny it. see it however you want, the fact remains that science shows marijuana to be less damaging than you claim...in fact, i'd go so far as to say it's not even damaging in most cases!
kinda...except for the fact that we have the AMA behind us and numerous medical associations recommending a change...
The AMA and other medical associations like marijuana because it sends more people to Emergency Rooms every year than car accidents do. The dangers of pot sends docs and nurses lots of business and makes them money, that's why those evil people like it so much.
these are scientists that know better than you. people with ph.d's. even our government holds a patent on medical marijuana even as they deny it.
That's a denial patent. Companies use patents as a weapon to keep inventions they don't ever want on the market from ever being built. The government hates marijuana because of the harm it does to citizens and society, and so the government has a patent to prevent any stupid private company from ever being able to get anything based on marijuana put into stores anywhere.
see it however you want, the fact remains that science shows marijuana to be less damaging than you claim...in fact, i'd go so far as to say it's not even damaging in most cases!
Science like the rehabilitation statistics that say 17% of all rehab admissions are for marijuana? That's double the rehab admission rate for crack cocaine.
The reason marijuana is so brutally dangerous is because of potheads (most of whom are convicted criminals and consummate liars as a result of their storied rap sheets) telling the little kids they prey upon that the substance is completely harmless. They leave out the fact that marijuana sends 100,000 Americans to emergency rooms each year and 4 MILLION Americans to drug rehabilitation programs each year.
Harmless, my ass.
Since this is my seed, I hesitantly read your posts MeanGene even though I have you on my ignore list.
Needless to say, you are full of @!$%#.
The AMA and other medical associations like marijuana because it sends more people to Emergency Rooms
Lie.
The government hates marijuana because of the harm it does to citizens and society,
Another lie.
The reason marijuana is so brutally dangerous is because of potheads (most of whom are convicted criminals and consummate liars as a result of their storied rap sheets) telling the little kids they prey upon that the substance is completely harmless.
More lies.
They leave out the fact that marijuana sends 100,000 Americans to emergency rooms each year and 4 MILLION Americans to drug rehabilitation programs each year.
Did you purposely leave out the fact so many people go to rehab is because when they get busted they either have the option to serve a mandatory jail sentence OR have the option to go to rehab? And that is why so many people choose rehab?
I was going to delete your post Meangene but you are entitled to your opinion, as misconstrued as it is.
But thanks for the laugh, anyway.
Did you purposely leave out the fact so many people go to rehab is because when they get busted they either have the option to serve a mandatory jail sentence OR have the option to go to rehab? And that is why so many people choose rehab?
Getting busted is what I'd call a "clue". If you're doing something which attracts the attentions of the local constabulary, then obviously you're engaged in some skullduggery because, no insult intended to the brave men and women of law enforcement, cops aren't exactly rocket scientists.
You need to be doing something majorly screwed up in order to get a cop looking at you. I mean world-class screwup, like driving the wrong way down the freeway screwed up.
Smoking a bong in your living room while watching Cartoon Network reruns isn't going to be what brings Five-O crashing through your door. Nope, you've got to be messing up out on the street to be getting Barney Fife on your case.
Look at the bust for pot yesterday involving Obama.
If you're a pilot carrying 10 Kilos of marijuana and you're flying into restricted airspace (10 miles around any aircraft carrying the President) then maybe you're a dumbass who deserves to get F-16s scrambled on you and forcing you to land. I can't imagine anybody feeling sorry for this pilot. The Cessna is probably gone, seized as part of the criminal act of smuggling. The pilot can probably kiss his pilot's license goodbye and won't be flying anymore.
Why? Because he did something incredibly stupid which got the attention of the police, which is exactly how these 4 Million people high on pot get busted and needing rehab. They did something incredibly stupid and got the attention of the police. They screwed up bad.
gene...gene...gene....heh heh...your statements are ridiculous enough to just leave alone...except for one or two points...in the '30's, when marijuana was first outlawed, the AMA was against it, when they realized that congress was switching the term marijuana for cannabis, and they knew even back then that it was a medicine that we as a people need for many ailments. also, the fact that there are high occurrences of rehab entrances is that the war on drugs focus on marijuana and many people getting arrested for marijuana are faced with two choices in court...do jail or prison time, or voluntary enter rehabilitation. not too hard to figure out why they mostly picked rehab. this is the sole reason why you have that fact which seems to stand in your favor, however it is not a solid point in your favor...
here's an interesting fact on the war on drugs:
out of 1,638,846 arrested for drug charges in 2010, 853,838 were non-violent marijuana related crimes. that's over 90% of all drug related convictions! (guess who were released to make room? murderers and rapists and other violent criminals.)
they are targeting marijuana when there are much more destructive drugs out there, at america's cost.
fbi arrest charts:
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/persons-arrested
they knew even back then that it was a medicine that we as a people need for many ailments.
Marijuana is not a medicine. It's a poison. The difference between a medicine and a poison is that a poison does more harm than good, which is exactly why marijuana is a poison and will never be a medicine.
In order to grasp the concept of the harm of marijuana to the patient, you must first realize that intoxication is a harm. Rendering a patient unable to drive, unable to work, unable to communicate normally and unable to function socially is a harmful thing. Medicines are for restoring normalcy, not for imposing disabilities and marijuana is disabling for memory function, motor skills, social skills and awareness. It's a poison through and through with no medicinal value capable of overcoming the harm. As a cure, it will always be worse than the disease because it is a poison.
also, the fact that there are high occurrences of rehab entrances is that the war on drugs focus on marijuana and many people getting arrested for marijuana are faced with two choices in court...do jail or prison time, or voluntary enter rehabilitation.
WHY DO THEY GET ARRESTED? It's a simple question. You know the answer. Potheads get arrested because they're stoned and stupid. 800,000+ arrests each year is not the result of brilliant police work, but rather the result of some damned stupid potheads committing crimes galore.
here's an interesting fact on the war on drugs:
out of 1,638,846 arrested for drug charges in 2010, 853,838 were non-violent marijuana related crimes. that's over 90% of all drug related convictions!
Who taught you math? You need to go get your money back if you actually paid for that education. 853,838 arrests out of 1,638,846 would be 51% of arrests, a far cry from 90%.
You're also making the rookie mistake of comparing arrests to convictions. An arrest != conviction.
Plea bargaining is always, ALWAYS to the lesser charge which is always, ALWAYS going to be the drug possession charge.
If Peter Pothead is arrested for assaulting a police officer and possession of marijuana, the plea deal will be to drop the assault charge in exchange for a guilty plea on the marijuana charge. This is exactly why potheads look like they're in jail for nothing but pot, but in reality they get busted for a lot worse than they get charged with.
(guess who were released to make room? murderers and rapists and other violent criminals.)
That doesn't actually matter because potheads are those self-same murderers and rapists and other violent criminals. Murderers and rapists and other violent criminals get screened for marijuana and come up dirty over 4 out of 5 times for having abused the vile drug.
If everyone who had ever used marijuana were somehow removed from our society, all violent crimes committed in this nation would immediately drop by over 90%. Getting potheads off the streets reduces crime because people who have used marijuana commit crimes at more than 9 times the rate of people who have never abused drugs.
pffffffffffffffft!
Studies assessing the anticancer properties of cannabinoids have shown that they inhibit the proliferation of a wide range of cancers, including brain cancer, prostate cancer, oral cancers, lung cancer, skin cancer, pancreatic cancer, biliary tract cancers, lymphoma, and breast cancer.
The dual effects of delta(9)-tetrahydrocannabinol on cholangiocarcinoma (biliary tract cancer) cells: anti-invasion activity at low concentration and apoptosis induction at high concentration.
The anticancer effect of Delta (9)-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), the principal active component of cannabinoids has been demonstrated in various kinds of cancers.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19916793 (government site)
Cannabinoids inhibit cellular respiration of human oral cancer cells.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20516734 (government site)
Anti-proliferative and apoptotic effects of anandamide in human prostatic cancer cell lines: implication of epidermal growth factor receptor down-regulation and ceramide production.
RESULTS: ANA induced a decrease of EGFR levels on LNCaP, DU145, and PC3 prostatic cancer cells by acting through cannabinoid CB(1) receptor subtype and this leaded to an inhibition of the EGF-stimulated growth of these cells.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12746841?dopt=Abstract (government site)
Cannabinoids reduce ErbB2-driven breast cancer progression through Akt inhibition
Results
Our results show that both Δ9-tetrahydrocannabinol, the most abundant and potent cannabinoid in marijuana, and JWH-133, a non-psychotropic CB2 receptor-selective agonist, reduce tumor growth, tumor number, and the amount/severity of lung metastases in MMTV-neu mice. Histological analyses of the tumors revealed that cannabinoids inhibit cancer cell proliferation, induce cancer cell apoptosis, and impair tumor angiogenesis. Cannabinoid antitumoral action relies, at least partially, on the inhibition of the pro-tumorigenic Akt pathway. We also found that 91% of ErbB2-positive tumors express the non-psychotropic cannabinoid receptor CB2.
http://www.molecular-cancer.com/content/9/1/196
Inhibition of skin tumor growth and angiogenesis in vivo by activation of cannabinoid receptors
http://www.jci.org/articles/view/16116/version/1
Δ9-Tetrahydrocannabinol inhibits epithelial growth factor-induced lung cancer cell migration in vitro as well as its growth and metastasis in vivo
http://www.nature.com/onc/journal/v27/n3/abs/1210641a.html
Cannabinoid Receptor-Mediated Apoptosis Induced by R(+)-Methanandamide and Win55,212-2 Is Associated with Ceramide Accumulation and p38 Activation in Mantle Cell Lymphoma
We have recently shown that cannabinoids induce growth inhibition and apoptosis in mantle cell lymphoma (MCL), a malignant B-cell lymphoma that expresses high levels of cannabinoid receptor types 1 and 2 (CB1 and CB2).
http://molpharm.aspetjournals.org/content/70/5/1612.abstract
Cannabinoids as potential new therapy for the treatment of gliomas (brain cancer)
http://www.expert-reviews.com/doi/abs/10.1586/14737175.8.1.37
Cannabinoids Induce Apoptosis of Pancreatic Tumor Cells via Endoplasmic Reticulum Stress–Related Genes
http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/66/13/6748.abstract
In order to grasp the concept of the harm of marijuana to the patient, you must first realize that intoxication is a harm. Rendering a patient unable to drive, unable to work, unable to communicate normally and unable to function socially is a harmful thing.
wow, someone forgot to tell big pharma this. also, did you know that driving and drugged intoxication accidents are in large part in thanks to big pharma?
Prescription Drug Abuse Exceeds Illicit Street Drug Use Worldwide
In the United States alone, the abuse of painkillers, stimulants, tranquilizers and other prescription medications has gone beyond "practically all illicit drugs...," with users increasingly turning to them first, the Vienna-based group said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,255758,00.html
and to everything else you reasoned....pfffft!!! thanks for the lol...
pffffffffffffffft!
Studies assessing the anticancer properties of cannabinoids have shown that they inhibit the proliferation of a wide range of cancers, including brain cancer, prostate cancer, oral cancers, lung cancer, skin cancer, pancreatic cancer, biliary tract cancers, lymphoma, and breast cancer.
The studies are worthless, as are the so-called 'scientists' who were only interested in getting their lab gloves on some weed to party hearty.
There is no credible scientist on the planet who has ever been a part of one of these studies/hookah parties.
A scientist would have to be intrinsically evil to even want to be around this damned demon weed.
LMFAO!!! just which is more evil? ignorance, or true knowledge?
joe my friend I know you try very hard to set the record straight which is very admirable.
But trust me, you will be banging your head against a wall for eternity trying to get MeanGene to see the light. I gave up on him a while back. You could be looking at a clear blue sky but he would disagree with you and say it was cloudy gray.
He is absolutely nuts and does not live in the real world. His reality is...well...I couldn't begin to describe it. Brainwashed at the very least.
i know i know...but it's not a total loss...he used to say potheads brought weed from mexicans exclusively...now he acknowledges that the average pothead doesn't even buy mexican schwagg...one small step forward, but of course 20 thousand miles back the next day...i just have to hang on to the belief that there are others reading these conversations and having their minds changed on the subject for the better...it's not only meangene's mind i'm trying to change, it's everyone who thinks marijuana is bad. which it isn't, of course...i think others that read them who agree at first with meangene's sentiments come to realize that maybe they were wrong, and when they see what he has to say about it, it drives them even more to our side, because it's obvious that his comments are outlandish, much more than you would expect from any sober individual...
Ah OK. I see your method now. Yes, if we can reach just one person at a time that is progress. That's why I still post my article on ending the drug war where it is appropriate because if I can get at least one person to read it I consider it a step forward.
LMFAO!!! just which is more evil? ignorance, or true knowledge?
Marijuana impairs the memory, and the basis of knowledge is what you can remember. If ignorance is evil then marijuana, which causes ignorance through memory impairment, is obviously evil.
Part of the problem with marijuana as medicine is that it impairs the quality of life. "Dude, Where's My Car?" is no way to make a life full of memories. A life with zero memories is no life at all. A stoner may as well be dead for all the knowledge he's gathering. The only difference between a zombie and a stoner is that zombies actually like brains.
what memory impairment? if you don't really know what you're talking about you shouldn't say anything...
Cannabinoid receptors are downregulated and desensitized when exposed to high doses of THC. This effect results in "drug tolerance," which occurs at varying rates and magnitudes in different brain regions. For example, it occurs faster and greater in the hippocampus, which regulates memory, compared with the basal ganglia, which mediates euphoric effect.24 This difference may explain why memory loss decreases among frequent cannabis users, but its euphoric effects remain.
http://www.jaoa.org/cgi/content/full/108/10/586
check out the last sentence...we don't suffer from memory loss because we're experienced and develop a type of tolerance so that we don't have any memory loss or impairment.
if you want to know more, i suggest watching "a norml life", it's a great informative documentary on medical marijuana...i don't know about you but i have a netflix subscription and it's on instant watch right now, so it's pretty easy to fire up and watch if you want. i mean, if you want to truly know your enemy, then you need to learn more about the enemy, such as how they think or what they believe in, right?
what memory impairment? if you don't really know what you're talking about you shouldn't say anything...
I know what I'm talking about. I've never used marijuana so I've got a fully functional and unencumbered mind.
check out the last sentence...we don't suffer from memory loss because we're experienced and develop a type of tolerance so that we don't have any memory loss or impairment.
That's the same as drunk drivers claiming they're as good as sober ones because they're experienced drunks. It's a ridiculous argument to make and laughable on its face.
if you want to know more, i suggest watching "a norml life", it's a great informative documentary on medical marijuana...i don't know about you but i have a netflix subscription and it's on instant watch right now, so it's pretty easy to fire up and watch if you want. i mean, if you want to truly know your enemy, then you need to learn more about the enemy, such as how they think or what they believe in, right?
I'm on permanent boycott of netflix because the bastards put popup ads across 90% of the internet sites and I hate popup ads.
The biggest fans of so-called "medical marijuana" are 20-30 year old males who don't have a damned thing wrong with them. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the conspicuous absence of actually sick people wanting the legalization of medical marijuana.
It won't happen.
The USA is moving towards prohibition and not away from it.
Take alcohol, for example. The USA raised the legal drinking age nationwide to 21, the highest legal drinking age in the world among nations which have a legal drinking age. Not only that, but organizations like MADD and SADD have managed to get the tolerance level for presumptive DUI reduced from .10% to .08%, and for professional drivers and pilots it's half of that or .04% which is basically zero tolerance.
Cigarettes aren't tolerated any better than alcohol. Its easier to name the two places where smoking is allowed (a personal house and a personal car is basically it) than it is to name the myriad places where smoking is prohibited. Not only that, but cigarettes are taxed at rates in excess of 700% in some areas of the USA as the highest sin tax in all of human history.
All of this adds up to the plain and simple conclusion that tolerance in the USA for stupid crap is on the decrease, not the upswing and so marijuana will not be legalized, not now and not ever.
#3 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:13 AM ESTwow gene...long time no see...nice to see you here to balance out the debate...party pooper.
There's no party to pooper. Marijuana, being the worst of everything about alcohol and tobacco combined, will never be legal anywhere that either alcohol or tobacco are outlawed. Taking the two substances together, it's obvious that there won't be anywhere marijuana smoking is allowed anyway.
Bowling alley? Nope. Movie Theater? Not a chance. Hospital? No way. School? Not happening. Concerts? Sporting events? Driving? Boating? At the mall? On the bus? Nope, nope, nope, nope and nope.
Between laws against secondhand smoke in public places and laws against public intoxication, dui and other restrictions, it's absolutely pointless to legalize marijuana. There are no public places where it would be legal or acceptable behavior anyway.
Legalization of marijuana is an issue which is dead on arrival. It wouldn't even be legal if some idiotic State did legalize it.
damn dude, i don't give a @!$%# about smoking it up in a public place...i just want to smoke it up in my living room and not have to wonder if some cops are gonna kick down my door...and if washington state does legalize it, they propose to sell it through the state liquor department, which means in effect it would be legal and available in said "idiotic" state...
damn dude, i don't give a @!$%# about smoking it up in a public place...
800,000 arrests for marijuana are made in the USA every year, and nearly all of them are in a public place because public places are the only places you ever see cops. I don't have a cop patrolling in my house. Do you have a cop patrolling in your home?
i just want to smoke it up in my living room and not have to wonder if some cops are gonna kick down my door...
You're polluting the nation when you do that. Marijuana is a noxious substance which should not be available on the streets because of the damage reefer madness causes. The drug is a hazard to public safety, as are marijuana intoxicated individuals. Because the effects of marijuana abuse are clinically proven to last for weeks on end, it's simply not possible to make the case that marijuana abuse has effects confined to getting stoned at home.
and if washington state does legalize it, they propose to sell it through the state liquor department,
What the HELL?? A State liquor department? I live in Arizona. We don't have that stupid crap, you'll only see state liquor departments in liberal freak states like Virginia where they have an Alcohol Board of Control. There's no such beast in Arizona, you can buy tequila off the shelf at the Kroger (Fry's) here.
You're actually making my point, that prohibition is becoming MORE INGRAINED into society, and it's mostly by liberals who are the control freaks. The first States to outlaw trans fats in restaurants were all liberal States, after all.
which means in effect it would be legal and available in said "idiotic" state...
Not for long. I suggest you read the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution. The Federal Government has a doomsday clause against States which fail to protect citizens in accordance with Federal Law, called the Equal Protection Act.
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Let me parse this for you. This means that Federal Law which states that slavery is illegal, Federal law which states that segregation is illegal, Federal Law which states that making unlicensed bombs is illegal, no State can countermand that. Marijuana laws are in the same class, and no State can countermand that law any more than the Confederate States can legalize slavery again.
The Federal Government will not lose any legal fight with the States concerning a contravention of Federal Law. If they could, then slavery could be re-legalized in about a dozen States in an election overnight.
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